The Catholic Message Board

In the first poll taken that asks the question "Did Kamala Harris lied about and help cover up Biden's cognitive decline?" 92% of registered voters answered "yes".

But that isn't the whole story, the follow-up question was not asked: "If you believe she lied, are you bothered by this fact? If you are bothered by it will it prevent you from voting for her?"


I doubt more than 20% of registered Democrats would answer "yes" to the first question, and probably no more than 5% would answer yes to the second.

You see, it doesn't matter if people overwhelmingly think she lied if their response to the lie is "She did what she had to do, that's what it takes to win", which is what most Democrats would say, if they were being completely honest.

Whatever it takes, win at all costs, vote Blue No Matter Who.

Sociopaths will sociopath.

Doom wrote: ↑Fri Jul 26, 2024 7:39 pm In the first poll taken that asks the question "Did Kamala Harris lied about and help cover up Biden's cognitive decline?" 92% of registered voters answered "yes".

But that isn't the whole story, the follow-up question was not asked: "If you believe she lied, are you bothered by this fact? If you are bothered by it will it prevent you from voting for her?"


I doubt more than 20% of registered Democrats would answer "yes" to the first question, and probably no more than 5% would answer yes to the second.

You see, it doesn't matter if people overwhelmingly think she lied if their response to the lie is "She did what she had to do, that's what it takes to win", which is what most Democrats would say, if they were being completely honest.

Whatever it takes, win at all costs, vote Blue No Matter Who.

Source?

The Economic Times has a report on a poll (still trying to find it's source, a vague "The Democracy Institute" google turns up a few groups) "62% of the respondents believed that the Vice-President had lied to the nation and 31% of them believed that she is innocent."

https://economictimes.indiatimes.com/ne ... s?from=mdr

Didn't click the link and have no views on what numbers are correct here. But I do have a question: imagine being one of those people who deny that Harris lied about Biden's status. So...how does that work? What do you think in that case? You think she is just so unspeakably idiotic that despite her at least occasional in-person encounters with the President, she couldn't see this thing that is so glaringly and undeniably obvious? I can't really see another alternative, frankly.

Since their playbook always includes the mantra,'repeat a big enough lie often enough, and people will begin to believe it'*, then there's only one of two possibilities:
1) they all lied
2) they don't care if anyone believes them or not

* This quote has often been attributed to Goebbels, but no primary source has ever been found that I know of

The question asked elicits answers about as accurate as the question "Are you still beating your wife?"

There is also a valid thought that Mr Biden does not have a cognitive decline, that his political enemies on BOTH sides have studiously combed through every video into a "greatest hits" that make the man appear to be a blubbering idiot.

Unfortunately, it doesn't take any combing, and after the debate, it's not a reasonable supposition that Biden is not gravely mentally compromised. I don't think it was a reasonable supposition before the debate, either, but that's not where we're at anymore.

So, yes, the question does presuppose that Biden is impaired. But this is not a presupposition that is unjustified, as it would be if you were to ask me if I've quit beating my wife--since you have no reason think that I ever did so.

Kage_ar wrote: ↑Mon Jul 29, 2024 12:47 pm There is also a valid thought that Mr Biden does not have a cognitive decline, that his political enemies on BOTH sides have studiously combed through every video into a "greatest hits" that make the man appear to be a blubbering idiot.

Nope, you can argue that he's still fit to be President (I don't believe that he is, but you can argue it), but it's inarguable that he's suffered from cognitive decline just over the past 4 years. And in 2020 he already wasn't as sharp as he'd been as Senator and VP.

I'm once again asking for the source of the original poll.

As for cognitive decline, I am not in any way, shape, or form qualified to make such a diagnosis based on videos - that goes for any candidate or other public persona. This sort of dx would come from the person's physicians and people who interact with the human in person over time.

Yesterday I had people asking if I was sick or something. I looked like 10 miles of bad road, I was distracted and could not find the words for things, I forgot some important things. Why? Do I have a permanent cognitive decline that means I should not be working?

I have not been sleeping. Going without sleep for 24 hours can be as impairing as having a BAC of 0.10%

https://www.cdc.gov/niosh/work-hour-tra ... d3/08.html

People on both sides like to armchair diagnose the "other" candidate with mental issues. One can find a plethora of articles, I'm posting one that is not behind a paywall https://www.usnews.com/news/politics/ar ... with-trump

"Cognitive decline" is not a diagnosis. "Dementia" is a diagnosis, though a vague one. It doesn't take a physician to note Biden's obvious cognitive decline. Nor is it somehow uncharitable or presumptuous to do so.

Kage_ar wrote: ↑Wed Jul 31, 2024 10:36 am Yesterday I had people asking if I was sick or something. I looked like 10 miles of bad road, I was distracted and could not find the words for things, I forgot some important things. Why? Do I have a permanent cognitive decline that means I should not be working?

Is it a pattern or is it just one bad day? With Biden it's the former, and I'm at a loss to understand how you don't see it.

peregrinator wrote: ↑Wed Jul 31, 2024 11:43 am

Kage_ar wrote: ↑Wed Jul 31, 2024 10:36 am Yesterday I had people asking if I was sick or something. I looked like 10 miles of bad road, I was distracted and could not find the words for things, I forgot some important things. Why? Do I have a permanent cognitive decline that means I should not be working?

Is it a pattern or is it just one bad day? With Biden it's the former, and I'm at a loss to understand how you don't see it.

I don't watch news or political commentary shows, don't have cable TV or subscribe to online "networks". I do not listen to talk radio or political podcasts. I am VERY selective about what I read and if I cannot find the primary source, I will give very little credence to a claim.

So, when someone states that a speech or an interview by either of the major party candidates reveals blah blah, I will go and seek out the full video to watch, and fortunately today it is pretty easy to also get the full transcript. When I do this, I am not watching cherry-picked gaffes or curated stumbles (and I do this for Mr Trump as often as for Mr Biden).

Do I see both men make mistakes? YES. Do I see things that, if the promoted clips were taken on their own would leave me to doubt the mental capacity, yes on both sides.

I do not have a "guy" in this race. I look at everyone without emotion or partisan loyalty.

Kage_ar wrote: ↑Wed Jul 31, 2024 1:08 pm Do I see both men make mistakes? YES. Do I see things that, if the promoted clips were taken on their own would leave me to doubt the mental capacity, yes on both sides.

What is happening with Biden today cannot be characterized merely as "making mistakes" - that's the old Biden before he ran for President, when he was famous for his gaffes.

92%? Has Harris ever told the truth about anything?

Tired wrote: ↑Wed Jul 31, 2024 11:02 pm 92%? Has Harris ever told the truth about anything?

This jumps the shark into rash judgment of another human being. How do statements like this bring healing to our world?

I don't think that's fair. It's not like he is picking on some random person. This woman claims to be fit to be President. It is reasonable to judge her honesty or lack thereof.

zeno wrote: ↑Thu Aug 01, 2024 2:06 pm I don't think that's fair. It's not like he is picking on some random person. This woman claims to be fit to be President. It is reasonable to judge her honesty or lack thereof.

I think accusing a person of NEVER telling the truth is absolutely rash, this means that she has lied when she told her mom "I love you" or she has lied when she said "I appreciate this lovely gift" or that she lied in her wedding vows, that she lied in every single case as a prosecutor, lied on her BAR exam....

I think it's a)obviously hyperbole and b)in reference to her public persona not private

If we're going to give the benefit of the doubt to public figures then we should give it to our fellow forum members too.

If a soft guideline for these discussions is "hyperbole is understood not to be real truth", let us apply that to every candidate, every source and not just to "my guy".